Shawn Records: The Road to Publishing pt. 1

In the week’s interview feature, photographer Shawn Records takes the opportunity to dig into what led three photographers who he has admired for years- Jason Fulford, Alec Soth, and Richard Renaldi- to become publishers. We also find out what each of them has learned along the way.

This is a two part series; Shawn talks with Jason about his publishing company, J+L Books, and Alec of Little Brown Mushroom, this week. Shawn’s interview with Richard, of Charles Lane Press, will be posted next week.

I’d like to extend a hearty thank-you to Shawn for taking the initiative and time to assemble these discussions, it is much appreciated.

First, Shawn’s interview with Jason Fulford, of J+L Books:

Shawn Records: First off, why become a publisher? Was it for control? Pleasure? Desperation? Fear (of someone else messing your work up)?

Jason Fulford: Mostly it was to create an outlet (or a venue), so that when Leanne and I fall in love with a body of work, or want to commission one; we can put it together in the best possible way, and then share it.

SR: J&L’s got so many titles now, is it your primary day job these days?

JF: I spend about a third of my time with J&L. It’s all volunteer though.

SR: Throughout your experiences, on both sides of the photo book equation- as photographer and publisher, what’s the biggest thing you’ve screwed up in all of it or what could you recommend others watch out for?

JF: I don’t have a good answer for this one…

SR: What’s going to be different with the next book you make? What is the next book you’re making? In both roles.

JF: J&L’s two spring releases, “Hey 45″ and “Mark West & Molly Rose”, are both sort of hybrid books, comprised of text and images in equal parts. My own next book, “The Mushroom Collector”, is also a sort of hybrid. It includes “found” photographs, my own photographs, plus a text that I’ve written, all more or less in equal parts.

SR: What about the necessity of a press-check? How did you choose your printer? Have you been on-press for all your books? Were you satisfied with what you were able to accomplish by being there or do you think the same effect could be achieved through two extra weeks and a few passes with Fed-ex?

JF: Press checks are one of my most favorite activities. I love watching the process, and I always make last minute changes. And generally, printers are more attentive to a project when you are present.

SR: What about distribution? How difficult has that process been?

JF: For the first couple of years, I went around to bookstores and distributed J&L’s books myself. Now we pay D.A.P. to take care of selling, shipping and billing. It makes life easier for J&L, but I kind of miss meeting with the book buyers.

SR: How long have you guys known each other?  And could you remind me why J&L put out Mike’s books and the Ice-plant put out Jason’s books? Is this all related to J&L’s non-profit status? And when and why did J&L become non-profit and has that changed the intention and/or catalog of what you’re putting out?

JF: Mike and I first emailed in 2001 when I was living in China. We met in person on my way back to New York (lay over in LA), and I asked him if I could publish some of his pictures. J&L’s first accountant (a Marxist comedian) suggested that we incorporate as a non-profit in 2004. Then the IRS said that we couldn’t publish books by the board members any more. “All benefits must flow to the public.” We’ve adjusted to it, and it works for us. We raise production funds through donations and grants, plus whatever profits come in from sales. We donate books to libraries.

SR: What about the direction you’re going in as publishers? How do you decide what to put out? One of the things I love about what you’re doing, both of you, is that I don’t know what to expect next. Anything you’re especially excited about for the future?

JF: It’s a mix of intuition and chance. In 2011, look out for somewatercolours (Canadian spelling) and fiction.

SR: One other thing- as publisher, how heavy is your hand in the editing process? I can’t remember where I heard it, but with Michael Northrup’s book, for example, it seems like I heard that he just gave you, Jason, a box of pictures and let you play? Also, with that particular book, I’m interested in the decision-making that led to such an aggressive design in the way that it spreads so-many center heavy pictures directly over the gutter. It seems like the responses that I’ve come across have been pretty polarized- love it or hate it.

JF: It’s always a collaboration between publisher and artist, but each book is a different story. Yes, Michael Northrup AKA “Strobes” showed me every contact sheet he’d made since the early 70’s. It was so intense — emotionally. He told me stories about the people in the pictures, many of whom are now dead. I had to pull over on the highway on my way home. I was crying. Anyway I made an initial edit, and then Paul Sahre, who designed the book (and the J&L logo by the way), cut it down to the final edit. Paul and Strobes go way back. You’re right, his design is controversial. I find myself on both sides of the fence (depending on the day).

Next, Shawn talks to Alex Soth, of Little Brown Mushroom:

Shawn Records: Throughout your experiences, on both sides of the photo book equation- as photographer and publisher, what’s the biggest thing you’ve screwed up in all of it or what could you recommend others watch out for? What’s going to be different with the next book you make? What is the next book you’re making?

Alec Soth: Each book is like a child, they are all unique. No matter how much you try, there are always accidents and happy surprises. As with parenting, it is almost impossible to give generalized advice beyond saying that you should try to give as much love as possible to each one.

SR: What about the necessity of a press-check? How did you choose your printer? Have you been on-press for all your books? Were you satisfied with what you were able to accomplish by being there or do you think the same effect could be achieved through two extra weeks and a few passes with Fed-ex?

AS: In contrast to my own books with Steidl, the books I’m publishing with Little Brown Mushroom are made to be inexpensive and have a rough, DIY feel. So press checks haven’t been necessary.

Las Vegas Birthday Book by Alec Soth

SR: What about distribution? How difficult has that process been?

AS: I also want the distribution to have a DIY spirit, so we maintain a bookstore and blog in hopes of generating word of mouth. Since my only financial goal is to break even, this has been enough thus far.

SR: What about the direction you’re going in? How do you decide what to put out? Anything you’re especially excited about for the future?

AS: Little Brown Mushroom has just been a place for aimless play. I’m working on doing something a bit more formalized, but am not ready to talk about it yet.

Lost Mountain Boy by Lester B. Morrison

SR: What about the format of the publications? Is there a consistency to the format that we can expect? That is, so far, everything (well, other than that sculpture - great video, by the way), is exceptionally affordable. Are you trying to keep all your titles in that range or do you have a $200 slipcased hardcover in the works too?

AS: I’m trying to keep things cheap. But there are no rules. If I want to produce something expensive down the road, I’ll do it. I’m beginning to see the future direction of LBM, but right now I’m just experimenting and having fun. If you talk to me in a year, I’ll probably have a much better sense of the mission.

Last Days of W by Alec Soth

SR: As a large-format photographer who’s been making big beautiful prints and books, was it liberating, or frustrating, to print the Last Days of W. on newsprint? Was that the intention all along?

AS: Oh, liberating. Definitely. This whole venture is about breaking away from expectations.

SR: Is that really a sold-out edition of 10,000 copies? Jesus, congratulations if so.

AS: We gave a ton of them away. Some were deposited in empty newspaper boxes. Others were handed out at openings. And my gallery in Berlin has a ton of them (if he didn’t throw them away). I still have some, but plan to hold onto them to show the grandkids.